As we continue to grow and add equipment and people, it become more critical that we allocate our limited spaces wisely. Temporary storage is one of those areas that requires everybody to share considerately. In the past we have reached out to those who have left items in storage beyond the maximum storage timeframes as a courtesy. However, that is too problematic for our limited staffing and is resulting in a lack of storage space. Beginning in March items left in storage beyond the maximum timeframe indicated on the storage forms AND items without a storage tag will be removed to the scrap bin or to trash WITH OUT notification.
Two suggestions to prevent you from losing your work and materials:
Make sure your label is securely attached to your work. Tape does not always adhere well to wood, especially dusty surfaces.
Set a calendar reminder in your phone
The following form is on the storage shelving. Please print in LARGE numbers the date you are placing items in storage. Example:
If you have an exemption from a steward or staff member, fill out their name and check the box indicating you have an exemption.
Paid storage is available for a monthly fee. Please see the wiki for current information.
Thanks for helping to keep the space useable for everyone!
No heads up? This seems a little ridiculous. Whatās the point of putting a phone number on storage tags at all?
To be clear, Iām completely in favor of having storage policyās and I even kind of understand not wanting to text and say āpick it up by tomorrowā because then that sets a precedent and requires more work, but I personally think our members are entitled to at least be informed that their projects have been thrown in the trash when it happens, not that they show up on the 8th day and their projects have just disappeared. That seems anti-member to me. Just my two cents, would love to hear what others think.
@gordoa40 , I understand your frustration. Unfortunately, I disagree with your assessment of phone calls to members. You contradict yourself by saying you understand not getting called to pick it up, but want a call afterwards to tell you your project items have been disposed of.
Members cannot have it both ways, which is why there is a policy that we agree to follow. Itās analogous to saying I understand Iāll get a ticket if I violate the speed limit, and then complain when you do and received a ticket. āBut I was only over the ticketable speed limit by one MPH the person claims,ā as if that somehow justifies violating the law.
Itās the members responsibility to set a calendar to remind themselves of when their storage item is at the seven day mark. If a member is unable to meet that date, a simple request to extend it can and should be made to via email. This at least affords the member the āpossibilityā of an extension depending on the circumstances. The request may or may not be approved, but at least that individual has taken some responsibility.
I get what you mean, but iām not trying to say there should be wiggle room at all. Even in your example, itās not black and white, as one mph over the speed limit is generally agreed to be an unreasonable reason to get a ticket, and I think if you told anyone you got a ticket for doing 61 in a 60mph zone they would think that was a cop abusing his power, not justice being served. Thatās not to say itās not still illegal, but grey area.
I think a better analogy to traffic would be automatic red light cameras. Yes, no one is arguing that running a red light is at all okay, but people were justifiably frustrated when they received an unknown ticket in the mail with no notice, and they were declared illegal.
Regardless, this isnāt law itās just a policy and I think the policy of our space shouldnāt be needlessly harsh. What if there was a funeral someone had to attend out of state and in their grief neglects to contact ASMBLY? What if there was some other emergency?
I think my question is: who does this no contact policy benefit? If the person who removes the project wants to stay anonymous then even an email from an official asmbly channel I think would be appropriate. Just to let them know their project is current in the trash or on the scrap cart and to come quick if they still want it. Thatās all I mean.
FWIW, this policy has not affected me at all, I am usually timely with my storage. Thatās not to say that Iāve never overstayed accidentally, but I make it a priority not to. I just think itās not a good policy.
I have been that person cheking the tags, it was normally done on āWork Days.ā It takes a long time and about 80% of the persons contacted said āI donāt need it, put it on the scrap section,ā 10% would have no answer, and 10% would say Iāll pick it up but only a few would actually do it. With this experience, i believe the drastic policy or actually enforcing the policy is best as it lets people aware of the consequences. Even now it is not actively enforced but it is enforced more often than before. I have violated the policy and lost material but have also benefitted from someone taking the time to send me a reminder of an overstay and still agree with the drastic policy. If is not enforced, the stuff piles up until the whole place is clutered with forgotten or abandoned material and there is no place to store your project temporarily or the āstorageā grows into other areas of the shop. It would be nice to get reminders but the precedent is there that often the material left there is not actually a working project. Also, you can contact Shane or put it right here on discourse, asking for some time for whatever reason. I do not know of a single time where they have said no. Above Charlie was being nice and actually giving a reminder that he checked and found violations.
I have been thinking about building an automated way to send reminders for storage and make this process easier for everyone.
Here is my idea and would love everyoneās thoughts:
The system would work a bit like those QR code tickets you get a parking garages.
Infrastructure required:
Cloud server instance
Thermal Receipt printer and Raspberry Pi with the required software at the shop.
Usage
When a user wants to store items:
They visit an āAsmbly Storage web pageā on any browser(mobile phone, desktop in shop, etc)
They enter their email address and a brief description of the stored materials.
The system stores the info and tells the local printer to print the storage ticket.
The Tickets are sequentially numbered in addition to the other info.
User places ticket as they usually do.
During storage period
User gets email reminders that they have stored items that will be removed in XXX days.
The email could provide a way to give 1 extension via the system and not contacting a person directly (but we wouldnāt want to allow forever or we would have same problem of overflowing storage as before)
The email could also provide a way for a user to say āyeah, go ahead and let my stuff goā¦I"m not going to be able to get itā
During Sweep Time
Stewards can access a report that shows all the expired ticket numbers. They will know that these members have already been notified or have willingly given up their items. They can easily scan for items in the storage area with #s that are āGreater thanā a week ago from the report and ignore the few items that have extensions on the storage periods
Special cases that could be handled
Steward Long term tickets for stock like CNC spoil board MDF sheets.
Would love to hear what people think about this idea!
I have only been at Asmbly one month, so I have not seen the storage shelves at their worst with overflowing projects months past due. I can imagine it would become frustrating and I understand why the policy is in place. Clearly it makes some sense to keep people on a schedule and on top of projects, and not abusing storage space. I do however think it needs to be reworked.
I do not agree with the removal of the good faith contact notice. I had let my ticket slip up by 3-4 days and my expensive hardwood lumber for a project for a client disappeared. It was partially milled and stacked nicely for movement and I had another project with the same date on a lower shelf. One project was gone and one remained. To me, this does not indicate someone following rules in an effort to respect the space. This is a scenario where someone saw anotherās slip up and took advantage of it. I think there should remain a good faith text in place stating āyou are past your storage date and it will be placed in scrap todayā. It really does not take that long. And if it does take some effort, who cares? Building a community like this takes some effort, and I would rather participate in one where people look out for each other. They donāt answer the text? Itās on them and there is a receipt that someone made an effort. If you can get on here to make a case, you can send a text the person violating storage dates. Iāve literally texted someone whoās tag I found on the ground asking where to put it.
I also think that only an on duty steward should have the ability to scrap things. My wood was not placed in scrap, it was directly taken home by someone. This is problematic. It doesnāt make sense for anyone to have the ability to just grab something for themselves when they see itās past the date (I doubt very few makers would actually do that). I DO value a rule system, law and orderā¦but I also deeply value another makers time, energy and money spent on their work. I would rather to take the time to check in with someone than just say āwell, too bad for them! Rules are rules!ā
We are in a shared COMMUNAL space, itās never going to go smoothly all the times. But we should be using common sense and dignity to determine our actions in situations, and honor a system of trust amongst each other. The responses I am seeing defending the storage system are dogmatic. Iām at Asmbly to learn and share tools in a space with other passionate woodworkers, not to defend my property. But I will be looking into the paid storage now.
We are adults and I think the answer can be worked out, whether you are exploring a hobby or trying to make a living we all ended up here for the same reasons and deserve patience and respect.
@berkeleyB Are you positive another member took your material? If thatās the case, itās something we would look into. As you said, only stewards and staff should be making the decision to move items to scrap or trash.
Is it not possible a steward/staff member moved your items to scrap, and then another member claimed them from the scrap cart? Iād expect partially milled hardwood would be claimed quickly from the scrap cart.
Berkeley, I think you made some great points, and it sounds like you already found a solution with Charlie.
When I joined years ago, everyone got a 10āx12āx15ā bankers box with their name on it, and that was it. As membership grew, we ran out of space for everyone, and moved to storage tags. It wasnāt a universally loved change at the time, but ultimately the new system serves more members, more flexibly.
This is absolutely a collaborative space, and weāre always trying to change and adapt to best suit everyoneās needs. That said: if you have ideas for improvement, please let us know, or better yet, help us implement them!
I hear you, and I agree that for a lot of the stuff on there, especially if it is months old, or some random offcuts or cheap plywood, Iām sure a lot of people donāt care and wonāt pick it up. Again, I am not asking for reminders regularly or a policy that you will get one āpick up by x date or it will get thrown outā message, as I definitely understand that doesnāt necessarily work and takes a lot of extra effort to check, and then go back and check again, etc. I have seen the storage space get cluttered and Iāve been frustrated myself when there is no space and several of tags that are weeks or months old.
I think in my opinion itās a grey area though. Sure itās nice to have a policy that works in every case and you just follow it to the letter and all is good in the world. But in reality, in our space, there is nuance, sure if thereās a tag from two months ago and itās a piece of 2x4, chuck that immediately. However I have a piece on the shelves right now that involves $800 of walnut and a month of my time. Itās currently dated 5/21, and if I canāt make it in this week and on 5/29 someone just threw it into the dumpster, I think that would violate the entire spirit and mission of ASMBLY, despite following the policy exactly. Sure you can argue that I shouldnāt have done that, I should have contacted administration, etc, but if I donāt, does the punishment really fit the crime there?
I think what Iām trying to say is that itās a judgement call whether a piece of overdue storage should be scrapped or not, and so I do understand if we want to make it a written policy to not contact before scrapping, but I would hope that in practice this is not expected to be followed to the letter of the law. Does that make sense?
Just so there is full transparency of the situation, I will specify it was discovered that it was a steward that moved my project. They can remain anonymous. It was however that only one project was moved, not all of the projects with expired tags. And it was not moved to scrap, it moved into their truck and taken home. This has been mediated and the wood is being returned, but I think this is an example of the system being flawed and not exactly being used to better the space for all involved nor keep order.
I definitely think that sounds like a lovely system, and in theory I think would work well! It does sounds a little complicated, so I worry that it could cause problems keeping it up and running, and if it did go down due to lack of internet, power, bugs, receipt paper, etc, it could cause more problems than itās solving w/r/t people not being able to tag their goods at all, then weāre back to square one. But if all the kinks could get worked out and we had adequate backups in place, then that sounds great!
I donāt think my intention re-starting this conversation was a complete overhaul of the storage system, just a discussion about policies and whether or not they truly benefit the members that weāre trying to serve. Personally, having been a member here for 5+ years, I have never had a problem with our storage situation. Maybe only a handful of times, ever, have I not been able to store something I needed to, and I think the quarterly work-day clean out was a fine solution. Now of course I say this as someone that has not personally done all of the cleaning out, though Iāve helped on other work-day projects, so maybe I just havenāt seen the worst of it from the inside.
If we can develop a new solution I think that would be great, though, and it sounds like a fun project too
Thanks for the response Evan! I do think the system now provides a good amount of flexibility for people, there are so many members. Obviously one of the main tenants of the whole system is/has to be trust. I think the courtesy text warning/reminder is a legitimate need. It would be cool if that was an automated message or bot or something, like maybe if a steward feels like itās too much energy for them to engage with/remember storage ticket issue they wouldnāt have to do itā¦.it could just be from the main computer or something and there isnāt an ability to respond to it even? Maybe someone has considered this before.
Like @gordoa40 has mentioned, I think this is just a judgment call on a lot of people but bringing it up again here can maybe have everyone on their best behavior with more visibility. As for space, I have yet to see it be an issue and there seems to be plenty. People are moving their projects at good pace, and itās probably because of the rules that are put in place already!
I hope to volunteer here and make the space better for everything too, I am very open to more ideas on how to contribute and help things flow more easily. Maybe there should just be a ~storage steward~
Maybe this is my callingā¦
Personally i like policies with the KISS principle (keep it stupid simple). Which is what is in place. If you have an exception like the $$$$ projects you ask, you get it, and you put in on the tag. The system is in place just not very clear. The technology mentioned above is great and probably would be a welcome change but at the end of the day you will always have someone unhappy when loosing a project or material questioning the fairness of the policy. I have lost a walnut slab ($350), a few sheets of plywood and other stuff and i did not question the policy. i was not happy but recognize the need of the enforcement. For the person that lost some milled lumber, i did pick two pieces about a month ago from the scrap bin that did not make sense being there. I only picked them up after they had been there over a day. If you can identify them i be happy to give them back.
Do we not have storage spots available upstairs? $25 for a month of storage seems like a bargain compared to the possibility of losing $300-500 worth of lumber.
Perhaps we need to move to 5 days instead of 7 days to reinforce that the temporary storage is for active projects and not for storage between weekends?
